What's your thought on corner pan-handlers?

[IDWITHELD]

Here in Beaverton it seems there are intersection panhandlers everywhere.

I've watched the same guy on the same corner for the last 2 years.

First he stood on the corner looking sad with a sign.
Then he upgraded to a cane.
Then he upgraded to crutches.
Now he has a wheel chair.

Here's my beef.
People are handing them coins and cash. The light turns green. Cars move forward. Then they all STOP while one driver flashes a buck for the "crippled" man to waddle out to collect. Invariably, he'll drop it causing additional delays.

Needless to say 2 or 3 cars get through the light when 12-15 should have made it.
I'm all for helping the needy, but isn't their a better, safer way that will prevent unnecessary traffic tie-ups?

I keep thinking to the ABC news story about a panhandler who they followed and it turns out he was not a vet (as his sign said), had a 4 bedroom house with a 3 car garage in an up-scale neighborhood.
His job was pan handling.

Rand done. What's your take on this topic?

[Salmonator]

The majority take the money to the corner store and buy a 40. All cities have resources for food and clothing and shelter.

[Dave G]

4 words.."Get a real job"

[flapbreaker]

I think city governement should get a handle on this (pun intended). I know beaverton had delayed the approval of the sportsmans warehouse plans because it was too "auto oriented" and it will sit at the gateway to the city, yet they tollerate pan handlers at all their on/off ramps? Seems odd.

[fishncliff]

Seatlle news followed a woman panhandler for a week. They filmed her with her school age daughter "working".
At the end of the week, they followed her to her house in Bellevue. Her husband works for Microsoft.

The police said it is legal to do what she was doing, but they were investigating her for keeping her child out of school.
The info was passed to the IRS and they started an investigation.

Some of the panhandlers in the PDX/ Vancouver area actually work for a guy in SE Portland. He gives them hours, locations and schedules. He gets a cut from their take. He claims them as "contractors". Portland( SAM ADAMS) is trying to shut him down, but he is using their own rules against them, and doing quite well.

I don't give them a look.

A guy had a sign that read "any help appreciated".
I pointed out the unemployment office and he cussed me.

Cockroaches.

[Dave G]

No, I tell you what, not 4 words. These people are a burden to society!! They chose to be bums! If you have two arms, two legs, two eyes, two ears "get a real job" They just do not want to pay taxes. They do this by being bums. I have never given an able bodied bum a dime. Remember I am a Vet, so when I see a bum that says they are a Vet , that upsets me. Even if they are a Vet (Except disabled) it up sets me. The one thing the military taught me was to be independent. When you are at 1100 feet in the air and your main parachute fails to open, there is no tree hugger to open my reserve chute for me, it is all on you baby!!!!! America is a give me give me give me nation. Forgive me JFK(if I blow the quote) , but what happened to "Ask not what your Country can do for you, but what you can do for your country" Don�t feel sorry for them, kick them in their butt, that�s is what they really need!

[JustCallMeDave]

Without knowing each of their situations I cannot pass judgment on them with a broad paint brush. For every story of the person panhandling for the day and driving off in their new Mercedes there are thousands of stories of people who due to a variety of unfortunate circumstances end up living on the streets. I cannot imagine what that is like, and I am glad that I don't know.

There is a saying out there about how a society can be judged by how they treat their least. Something to chew on.

However, if they are holding up traffic then that is a hazard and police should be asked to intervene.

[boomguy]

As long as people keep giving them $$ they wont leave. Human nature, why work hard if I can get it for free. Some of them might be in total need, but others are just out to make a quick easy buck. I do not give them anything but maybe a soda or small burger. Never $$. Who knows what they will use it for. Offered one to come and rake leaves when his sign said will work for anything and he turned me down. If you stare them down most of the time they will back down.

I could go on and on about (socalled) transients and imigrant workers which we pay for to be here (AND SEALS) but there is not enough time to sit here and type. I have a REEL life.


Remember to take a kid fishing. You will remember it forever.

[Hook-Line-N-Sinker]

Just do the math to figure out how much these people are making.
Most light cycles are about every 1-2 minutes. If one car every 5 cycles gives a bum a buck, they are taking "home" anywhere from $12-24/hour (without paying a dime in taxes except for on the cigarettes and liquor they purchased after they "got off work" the day before).

I think it is wrong and the fact that our goverment officials find it acceptable is even worse.

[drhall99]

I don't mind helping people truly in need but these people are not them. They are manipulating the good Samaritans of the world. I see the same people week after week. All of my suggestions for dealing with them involve things like paint ball guns, coins heated with blow torches and violate the AUP...
In other words, I don't like them very much

[JCJ]

Good article on KATU web page about panhandlers in Coos Bay,saying the police estimate they make 300 a day and this is tax free.Apparently it is protected by free speech but as long as there are the easy touches giving them money they will be there.And no matter what you call them.homeless,downtrodden,financially challenged or whatever the current PC word of the day is BUMS is BUMS and should be dealt with appropriately.If they choose to not work and stand on a street corner begging,then that is their choice in life but do not ask me to feel for them or give them anything because they might have a reason for being there.We all make choices in this life and if this is theirs then so be it,too many jobs available around here if you really want to work for the money,the illegals seem to have no problems working but we are supposed to feel for the bums,get a job and stop being a drain on society.Thats becoming a large problem in PDX,way too many people with their hand out for money,if your not part of the solution then guess what,your part of the problem!!

[1pump]

Some of the panhandlers in the PDX/ Vancouver area actually work for a guy in SE Portland. He gives them hours, locations and schedules.

That would explain the Division off-ramp from SB I205. Those guys are a little too organized, and it's been the same ones for years.

It's like anything else in a consumer-driven economy; it there's no market for it, it'll go away.

[Duckwheat]

I offered one a job cleaning up my yard, a ride to and from. Did not want to do it.

I think most are on a career path.

DW

[PapaHog]

[Jedcraft]

Passed a law that went into effect Jan. 1, 2008 down here in Medford. No begging at "controlled"(stop light) intersections. Didn't work - seems worse.

[saber_jack]

Saw one in Portland whose sign said "Girlfriend kidnapped. Need money for ransom." Had to laugh at that one.

But I have never and will never give money to someone collecting at an intersection.

[ORhunter]

Ya really got to wonder about the folks who who give them money. They certainly aren't as smart as the pan handlers. A real idiot (id-ee-uht) society.

[Don Becker]

Beaverton Police caught a highly placed executive, with a big company we were told we would have recognized had they told us the company name, panhandling near the Fred Meyer some time back. (This came directly from Beaverton police with other officers in attendence.) The guy would change into rags, in his car in the lot and panhandle over the noonhour. Don

[Got One!]

Personally we give 10% to food banks (usually in food), shelters such as battered women with kids, stuff like that. I wont give a dime to a corner beggar. (I have confronted a few after the wife came home and said they were bangin on her car window for $$..that got ugly...) But to each there own

[fishstik]

Whenever i pull up and there begging next to the window of the truck i just stare em straight in the eyes till they look away. Makes my wife mad but i say this, life is all about choices its about time they started making some good ones. I know there is the exception now and again but for the most part they can be productive in some sense...

[Kalamity]

Originally Posted by PapaHog

If I had a boat, I'd give ya a ride. I bet I could learn a lot from you...

[uhmw]

If you could walk a day in their shoe(saw a one leged guy the other day) you might have a different perspective Im glade I dont have to do this to get by or feed my children. I gave a fella one of my extra cheese burgers and he seemed genuinly thankfull. I dont generally directly give but I do feel compastion for them and their begging dosent irk me.

[ORrinker]

Roseburg found a unique way to get around the free speech issue by making it illegal to stop and hand money from a car as it impedes traffic. The ones getting the fines are the drivers. If the cash flows go away so will the panhandlers:-)

Randy

[TheTexan]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22985878

I'll give to charities, but never on the street. I offered day jobs and bought a few cups of coffee and some meals, but will never give cash.

[drhall99]

My favorite ones are the ones with freshly washed clothes and hair but they are carrying a sign saying that they are living outdoors.. Or the big fat ones saying that they are starving.

[dodgeboy252000]

i generally dont give to pan handlers but there is one that use to be in the sportsmans warehouse parking lot in salem that we would give to when we saw him he had no hands i will help those people any chance i can. the rest can get a job

[Stowaway]

A few years ago in downtown Portland a guy in a wheelchair asked for some money. I didn't have any to give him but the next guy he asked gave him a dollar. The guy walked away and the man in the wheelchair pulled out of his cargo pocket one of the largest stacks of money I ever saw. With the few minutes it took him to thumb through the 100's, 50's and 20's to get to the middle where there was maybe 4 or 5 single one dollar bils. I would guess he had somewhere near 5 grand.

[IDWITHELD]

I have enormous compassion for the needy.
The problem is recognizing WHO is ACTUALLY needy.
I donate my time and several thousand dollars per year with two charities that work with my company. I lead by example. My efforts directly affect the hungry and a womens shelter. I am confident I am getting my monies worth.

My struggle is with this: Can you imagine the discipline it takes to stand at the same corner for 8 hours a day, every day? Rain, heat, exhaust fumes, uncomfortable stares, people making rude comments etc.? How can a person who can (tirelessly) perform so well under those conditions NOT GET A REGULAR JOB?

In the mid 90's I turned into the Freddy's in Beaverton (off 217). There was a girl on the corner with 3 pieces of luggage. She was attractive and her luggage was new and in perfect condition. Her cardboard sign said something like "need bus fare to San Francisco". I finished my business at Freddy's and caught the light on her corner. I asked her what was going on and if she really needed cash for a bus ticket. She looked genuine and her hard-luck story was plausible. I gave her a 20 dollar bill. She thanked me. I left.
3 hours later I drove by there. She was gone. I never saw here again.
I think here story was true. It made sense to help - it felt right. Maybe because she was out of place?
But now, the hobos are regulars on the corners and I'm just not sure if I am promoting a drinking or drug habbit or if they are just scamming the system.
My instincts tell me its a scam. This doesn't mean I'm not compassionate, just suspicious.

[Irish Pennant]

I always give to the needy, I donate to political candidates.

[ajfishfinder]

99% of them are nothing more than a wart on the back of ---never mind. This pretty much sums it up for me. That guy down on the NW industrial exit worked the 217 canyon off ramp for 3 years before moving. I asked him what his handicap was. He said he couldn't write. I told him there are millions of illegals here that not only can't write but most can barely speak english. Funny how they can find work. It used to really irk him when I would hand him the help wanted section of the paper. Once he figured out what truck I drove, he was no fun at all. He does know some choice words to yell when I tell him to get a job.

[yankemnbankem]

One woman I know gives out canned food she keeps in a box in her car just for those people. Better than money. I myself am self employed and I have a really hard time with "those people" collecting tax free dollars and messing with traffic. Im not saying they have no right it's just that I have a REALLY HARD TIME with it. Some of the stuff I have done and said to them probably isnt right either but it makes me see red.

[matttheduck]

Like most here, I give money or items to charitable organizations whom I trust to do right by my donation. I never give on the street. The stop light/stop sign folks seem too well organized to be "real."

A few years ago when I was "between opportunities," I tried to get my spouse to hold up a sign at an intersection that read, "Please help. Two kids in private school. God Bless."

She wouldn't do it.

[Cornbread]

Sort of related. I was in a car with my friend and his little girl down in Phoenix AZ one time and we pulled up to a stop and there was a guy there with a sign that said "Homeless anything helps" or something like that and my friends little girl asked why the man was there and her Dad said it was because he was homeless and he was begging for money. She pipes up "Daddy if he is homeless then where did he get the marker and cardboard to make the sign with?". I laughed so hard I had trouble breathing. I suppose his little girl is in college by now but I never will forget her little girl logic that day. Still cracks me up when I think about it.

[Jedcraft]

They don't want a job - they just want $$. Have a friend who runs a business in Spokane that took one whole Saturday and went around and handed his business cards out to all the beggers he could find. Said show up on Monday and I'll put you to work. Guess you know how many showed up. ZERO

[feisty's wife]

Originally Posted by PapaHog

ROTFLMAO...is that you, Papa?BTW....at one point in my life, I was a homeless vet for 4 year's...I finally turned it around, been sober 21 year's...give ONLY when the Spirit will move you, you answer only for what you have done, and whyI was a pan-handler, too a silver tongued little devil, say ANYTHING to get a drink.Glad it's over

[Wreckless]

If they were relying on me for a hand out =, they'd need a job!!

I kinda feel sorry for the handful of REAL homeless people who may NEED to beg for $$...The "will work for food" franchises have messed it up for them.

BTW - Papahog, that picture is PRICELESS, I'll Take ya fishing ANYTIME!!!

[JustSteve]

I work night shift on a paramedic unit in Portland. I see a lot of people in some really bad conditions. What I don't see are folks begging for money. I am under the impression that the money beggers have gone home to their families and homes, while the people who really need the help chose to live their life wrapped in plastic sleeping on a park bench while it's blowing rain and snow. I just don't get it...but at the same time, reports say that over 90% of the truly homeless suffer from mental illness and 25% of those are former military. I don't know if it's folks who served a full tour and just couldn't adjust to an unstructured life, or people who washed out of "the system" while being trained, or what the story is...pretty sad no matter how you slice it.

I don't pass out money but I'll offer a snack bar if I get the vibe that they really are in need. I personally use their shoes as a gauge. Most of the posers may have ratty clothes, but their shoes are in great condition. When I see someone looking pretty beat up, and their shoes match the rest of the picture, I'll take a moment for that person.

Steve

[nx302stang]

I just give em food, no cash.

[flapbreaker]

Originally Posted by IDWITHELD

My struggle is with this: Can you imagine the discipline it takes to stand at the same corner for 8 hours a day, every day? Rain, heat, exhaust fumes, uncomfortable stares, people making rude comments etc.? How can a person who can (tirelessly) perform so well under those conditions NOT GET A REGULAR JOB?

I have always wondered the same thing. It would be easier to get a job but most likely they are on unemployment and don't want to risk a loosing that by getting a job.

There's a lady that has claimed the entrance of Costco in Hillsboro. She looks nice, is not filthy but is obese. She stands there all day with a sign begging for money. That has to be terribly tiring and hard on the legs/back. The fact that she can stand there all day tells me she is not disabled. I also wonder what she would do if someone stole her spot? Is there pan handler etiquette?

[IDWITHELD]

Originally Posted by flapbreaker

II also wonder what she would do if someone stole her spot? Is there pan handler etiquette?

I can see it now: ( Pan-handler on pan-handler crime is up 67% in Beaverton. More at eleven.

[Pilar]

Yeah that is rough. And quite possibly illegal. I don't know many of these street beggars but I have seen the guy with the long white ponytail at the west end of the Ross Island bridge a bunch of times I would know him on sight. That was bound to happen after he stood there every year 9 months out of the year.

For over 10 years.

He'll be back in March.

Don't like em? Well then ignore them. As has been said the real homeless hang out somewhere else besides the on ramp with a sign. They push a shopping cart with plastic over it and do not carry a nice new rucksack.

[JustCallMeDave]

Thanks for the dose of reality, JustSteve. If someone went by the majority of the responses here, you'd think that the truly homeless and needy didn't really exist.

[Antlershed]

There is a guy who stands down the street from my house here in Seattle holding a sign that reads "Need Money. Can't afford medical supplies." All the while I have seen him smoking and talking on a cell phone while holding the sign.

[StickFish]

Like others have said its all about the shoes. Look at the shoes and the knapsack. I've also caught a shift change or two at 217 and Beaverton Hillsdale.

Read the riot act to one after getting stopped (twice) at the light coming out of Beaverton Town Square by Fred Meyer from people plugging up the road trying to give these people money. Sitting through three lights was enough for my hypertension that day.

Ive seen the food stuffs people have given them discarded not far from their duty station left on the ground as garbage.

[Keeper]

I have thought about snagging the spot by the Hillsboro Costco!!!! I need boat money She is always dressed nicely, stays dry in her rain gear and can afford fancy coffees from Starbucks.

Too many people are preying on the kindness of others. This has really messed it up for those people that are truly in need.

[flapbreaker]

Originally Posted by Keeper

I have thought about snagging the spot by the Hillsboro Costco!!!! I need boat money She is always dressed nicely, stays dry in her rain gear and can afford fancy coffees from Starbucks.

Too many people are preying on the kindness of others. This has really messed it up for those people that are truly in need.

LOL, I have often wondered what kind of reaction she would have when she shows up at "work" and there's someone else in "her" spot. Could be entertaining.

[JustCallMeDave]

Last night while at work, I was the only one manning the place. Just before the end of my shift a man walks in with a neatly-manicured, salt and peppered beard and moustache, and a warm coat. It had been raining quite a bit, and he was obviously wet under his wool hat.

He approached me and said that in the past the employees here had been very nice to him and allowed him some coffee or tea if any were left over. He was very well spoken as he asked if I had any leftovers tonight. I told him that we did, and he went over and filled his travel mug. While filling his mug he talked about how much he appreciated the kindness, and also how his wedding anniversary was coming up and that he hoped to do something nice for his wife when their "situation changed". I did not ask about the situation, instead agreeing that it would indeed be nice. The bottom half of the mocha-colored corduroy pants that he wore were soaked, and though I did not notice his shoes the condition of the pants lead me to believe that he had been walking outside awhile.

After filling his mug he told me about how he and his wife own a home in Knappa that has a perfectly unobstructed view of the Columbia river. They had purchased it many years ago, before the property values went up dramatically. We talked about the current housing market in the North Coast area, in the Portland Metro area, and elsewhere. He asked if I thought that it was a buyers market or not, and I said that there did seem to be a lot of properties for sale. After a moment more he politely excused himself, thanking me again for the generosity. I offered him a couple of cookies for the road, which he accepted and then left.

The next shift came in shortly after, so I clocked out and headed for my car. I could barely make out his figure in the rainy darkness as he walked onward, long past the area where the cars were parked. As I drove past I pondered what his story may be, and what may have put him into his current "situation".

How odd it is that he would come by shortly after reading this thread. I believe that there is a reason for it, and I have taken that reason to heart. What I took from the experience is that many of us could just as easily find ourselves in his same situation. That no matter what our education, our employment status, or our social standing, we could be there far quicker than we want to publicly admit.

Somehow I feel that the coffee and cookies that I helped him with pale in comparison with how he helped me.

[fishkisser]

Well spoken Dave ... Most folks are a few paychecks from a bad situation themselves ... Some people choose to be homeless panhandlers ... And others have this harsh reality thrust upon them ...

[pdxkevin]

There is a couple who work the west bound exit off HWY 26 @ 185th, sometimes with their dog. While my wife was in the 7-11 right there, I sat in the car with the kids asleep and watch the shift change.

I say shift change because that's what it was. He walked across the parking lot to a spot tucked back just beyond the PizzaHut over to a brand new 4-door subaru. He put the dog in the back seat and got into the driver's seat. About 2 minutes later, she got out of the front passenger's side and headed back up to the corner. He pulled out of the spot and drove around the back side of the parking lot. We were pulling around the other way to get back out on our way and I saw that he had taken off the ratty jacket and put on a ballcap covering his hair. He headed right up towards West Union Village and I went the other way back out to the HWY... I have a hard time believing that this pair is truly hard up if they are driving a new subaru!

[flapbreaker]

Originally Posted by pdxkevin

There is a couple who work the west bound exit off HWY 26 @ 185th, sometimes with their dog. While my wife was in the 7-11 right there, I sat in the car with the kids asleep and watch the shift change.

I say shift change because that's what it was. He walked across the parking lot to a spot tucked back just beyond the PizzaHut over to a brand new 4-door subaru. He put the dog in the back seat and got into the driver's seat. About 2 minutes later, she got out of the front passenger's side and headed back up to the corner. He pulled out of the spot and drove around the back side of the parking lot. We were pulling around the other way to get back out on our way and I saw that he had taken off the ratty jacket and put on a ballcap covering his hair. He headed right up towards West Union Village and I went the other way back out to the HWY... I have a hard time believing that this pair is truly hard up if they are driving a new subaru!

Probably just a salty dog getting some more money for his Tuna fix. Don't encourage them.

[Texascat]

I dont give to them, but I do give to Texas Childrens Hospital.

[Just_learning]

If you really want to see needy, come to the NE and experience one of the winters out here. See the sad sight of seeing someone sleeping on a steam grate when it is 10 degrees out. They are needy, and I try to at least pick up cans of Thick and Chucky soup at CVS on my way home when I need a thing or two and give them to some of the homeless.

Trust me, some are really helpless and needy. Otherwise, they would find somewhere else to be instead of sleeping in sub freezing temperatures and digging in trash cans for food. Living and working in the city, I know which ones are needy because I see them every day.

To me it doesnt matter if they are a vet, black, white, whatever. I know the slightest misfortune could put me in that position within 2 years. I only hope that someone would have the humility to spare me a dollar, something to eat or at least acknolwedge my existence in a positive way.

Philly is one of the worst cities for poverty and crime in the country. We hear about it in other far off places that need our help. There are americans who are hungry, cold, tired and in need of assistance and we do nothing but complain about how they get in our way. Thats what ****** me off.

[Threemuch]

I feel bad for those less fortunate than me, and begging for money on an on-ramp certainly qualifies. I am guilty of occasionally indulging my own sense of guilt about my own good fortune by giving some money to a pan handler. I know I shouldn't, but I do. I also know I should do something more constructive for the poor, like volunteer in a shelter or soup kitchen, but I don't, and I am not sure why.

[Don Becker]

N Vancouver & NE Broadway: . . . what's with that black pan-handler that lays down, prone, on the East sidewalk, then jumps up to get the fruits of his labor or to move over onto the lane divider and lays down again? If you've seen his antics, you know who/what I'm talking about - - he's there frequently and often with one or two other (shall we say, more ordinary) panhandlers. Don

[lor]

Originally Posted by feisty

give ONLY when the Spirit will move you

When I was in Graduate school in a decent size city, I kept spare change in my pocket. The first person to ask got the money, some days I was able to keep my change, others it didn't last long.

Fast forward to a few years later in Oregon. I would see people off Hwy 26 as I'm enterring the freeway. My first thought was, how did this person get out here. I've worked in this area for over a year and have never seen a homeless person, why here on the freeway. One day when I was about to give a dollars, the guy got a call, on his cell phone.

I sat there thinking, I have a wife, job, house, and I don't even own a cell phone, something is wrong here.

Since then I've had several people approach me with the same hard luck story, I need money for the max fare. I've given them outright day passes and while driving or walking around the corner seen them continue panhandling for more.

To answer the question, if I feel its legitimate, I will give, however if it looks fake, or a person who I can clearly see is using meth, I keep my money.